EPrints Technical Mailing List Archive

See the EPrints wiki for instructions on how to join this mailing list and related information.

Message: #07392

< Previous (by date) | Next (by date) > | < Previous (in thread) | Next (in thread) > | Messages - Most Recent First | Threads - Most Recent First

Re: [EP-tech] ORCID Support Advance Update

Thank you for this useful information, I really appreciate it!

If I understand correctly, then, in order not to lose the ORCIDs for authors collected through ORCID Support plugin, we would have to do the following:

 

·         Ensure that every ORCID in an author field matched on the email field with a user profile record.  This would require adding the ORCID id to user profiles and/or the email address to the author field whenever ORCID is included.

 

If that is done, then the ORCID Support Advance plugin will not delete any of these ORCIDs, right?  What sorts of permissions will it assign to them?

 

Best wishes,

Tomasz

 

Thank you also to Will, Jan and John for the broader discussion about ORCID IDs that I do believe we need (https://twitter.com/photomediathink/status/1012051960676212738).  If we are going to promote ORCID, it has to make sense as a system.  If we can only refer to ORCID IDs of authors who have an account on our IR, then we would need another global identifier for the other authors that we can’t use an ORCID for.

 

 

 

 

From: eprints-tech-bounces@ecs.soton.ac.uk <eprints-tech-bounces@ecs.soton.ac.uk> On Behalf Of John Salter
Sent: August 2, 2018 7:14 AM
To: eprints-tech@ecs.soton.ac.uk
Subject: Re: [EP-tech] ORCID Support Advance Update

 

Hi Will,

Thanks for that clarification - I was a bit worried there for a moment!

 

I think the ORCID landscape is shifting from a 'get people to sign up for an ORCID' to 'sharing the data sensibly/properly'.

We are a key part of that!

 

Cheers,

John

 

From: eprints-tech-bounces@ecs.soton.ac.uk [mailto:eprints-tech-bounces@ecs.soton.ac.uk] On Behalf Of Will Fyson
Sent: 02 August 2018 12:03
To: eprints-tech@ecs.soton.ac.uk
Subject: Re: [EP-tech] ORCID Support Advance Update

 

Apologies, my previous email was a little bit flippant on this issue! I agree we need to try and store authenticated ORCIDs wherever possible. To that end we're working on adding an annotation system so that where an ORCID is imported from a trustworthy upstream system, this bit of provenance is stored and we know not to try and check this ORCID against a user account.

The alternative approach would be to introduce a notion of guest/external users to EPrints so that when external authors are added we can store the fact that this user was added via a trustworthy upstream system and we have an actual user object for them.

Ultimately I believe ORCID themselves would prefer the idea that the repository emails the external author and so the author can authenticate their ORCID - this too would no doubt be easier to do with a guest/external user type, but should the ORCID plugin(s) be introducing new user types and muddying the user dataset?

Many thanks,

Will


 

 

 

From: John Salter [J.Salter@leeds.ac.uk] Sent: 02 August 2018 11:32 To: Eprints-tech Subject: Re: [EP-tech] ORCID Support Advance Update

> This naturally poses a problem for storing ORCIDs for external authors, but in my experience most repositories are happy storing ORCIDs for just their own users.

 

This concerns me. We (repository developers) shouldn't be encouraging a blinkered approach to ORCIDs (or other persistent identifiers).

You wouldn't exclude a DOI for a paper if it wasn't minted by your institution - so why would you choose to discard ORCIDs for non-local members?

 

If the ORCID has come from a trustworthy upstream system (e.g. CrossRef, PubsRouter), then the ORCID should stay with the author.

Local ORCIDs can supplement this data - so a record harvested from your repository is 'improved'.

 

I was reading this: https://support.crossref.org/hc/en-us/articles/214567746-Authors-and-editors recently - and wondering what the 'authenticated="true"' attribute actually meant - and how the this assertion should be passed between systems.

If a *trusted* upstream system states that an ORCID is authenticated - can we as a consumer of that data also state that the ORCID is authenticated when relaying data from our system?

 

The ORCIDs should be seen as an 'additive' set of data - if your system can state that an author now has an ORCID - do it.

Just don't throw away data that already exists for non-local authors.

 

Cheers,

John

 

From: eprints-tech-bounces@ecs.soton.ac.uk [mailto:eprints-tech-bounces@ecs.soton.ac.uk] On Behalf Of Will Fyson
Sent: 02 August 2018 10:59
To: eprints-tech@ecs.soton.ac.uk
Subject: Re: [EP-tech] ORCID Support Advance Update

 

Hi Tomasz,

The ORCID Support Advance plugin does only allow ORCIDs to be stored against creators/editors if they can be matched to a user via the 'Email' column in all circumstances (to facilitate the read-only nature of the field). Therefore ORCIDs added through use of the ORCID Support plugin are affected by this too.

When we've been installing the Advance plugin on repositories we've been encouraging administrators to tidy up their ORCID data so that the ORCIDs stored are matched with user profiles. This naturally poses a problem for storing ORCIDs for external authors, but in my experience most repositories are happy storing ORCIDs for just their own users.

If an email isn't present in the creator/editor field, but an ORCID is, the ORCID would be removed the next time the EPrint is recommitted. The ORCID Support Advance plugin contains a pre-commit trigger that updates the ORCID field based on the email column to help keep the record up to date. These triggers are disabled by default when the plugin is installed however to prevent any accidental erasing of data by installing the plugin. (the fields are read-only upon installing the plugin however and so until the triggers are re-enabled the content of the creator/editor ORCID fields is essentially fixed.)

I hope this helps answer your questions!

Many thanks,

Will 



 

From: Tomasz Neugebauer [Tomasz.Neugebauer@concordia.ca] Sent: 01 August 2018 17:50 To: Eprints-tech Subject: Re: [EP-tech] ORCID Support Advance Update

Hi everyone who has installed the ORCID Support Advance plugin, Will…

 

I am still looking to get a clearer picture of what I can expect to happen when I install the ORCID Support Advance plugin on top of the ORCID Support plugin that we currently have working.

 

What will happen to the ORCID ID’s that we have already collected in the author field of publications?

 

The description from Will below about ORCIDs from a DOI import says this:

“, the ORCID field uses the creator/editor 'Email' column to lookup user profiles in the repository that have connected to orcid.org so that the creator/editor ORCID field can be verified. As such any ORCID added via a DOI import, might then be erased if the user profile lookup cannot be made. “

 

Does the above also apply to any ORCIDs that we have been collecting using the ORCID Support plugin?

 

I don’t think that our depositors have been diligently filling in the email column in the author field during the deposit process, does that mean that the user profile lookup will fail and the ORCID will be deleted for any author that doesn’t have an email listed in the author column? 

When does this deletion happen, during indexing? Is there any way to prevent it from happening?

 

Thanks so much for any insight or advice on this is really appreciated.

 

Tomasz

 

 

 

 

 

From: eprints-tech-bounces@ecs.soton.ac.uk <eprints-tech-bounces@ecs.soton.ac.uk> On Behalf Of Will Fyson
Sent: July 11, 2018 10:16 AM
To: eprints-tech@ecs.soton.ac.uk
Subject: [EP-tech] ORCID Support Advance Update

 

Hi Everyone,

A couple of minor updates have been applied to the ORCID Support Advance plugin, bringing it up to version 1.3.2.

The updates are only very minor, fixing issues where the plugin was generating a few too many messages in the indexer and error logs. A Change Log documenting these most recent changes is available at https://wiki.eprints.org/w/ORCID_Support

Regarding the discussion a couple of emails above in the EP-Tech list ("Import by DOI in ORCID plugin"), a new DOI imported that takes ORCIDs into account is not available at present. Due to the requirements that the ORCID field must be readonly when connected to the member API so that ORCIDs can only be added via an authoritative source, the ORCID field that is added to the creator/editor tables cannot be edited. Therefore to stop values from being entered, which then later cannot be removed, the ORCID field uses the creator/editor 'Email' column to lookup user profiles in the repository that have connected to orcid.org so that the creator/editor ORCID field can be verified. As such any ORCID added via a DOI import, might then be erased if the user profile lookup cannot be made.

This is an issue we're looking into resolving however and so hopefully we should have some updates on it in the future!

Many thanks,

Will




*** Options: http://mailman.ecs.soton.ac.uk/mailman/listinfo/eprints-tech
*** Archive: http://www.eprints.org/tech.php/
*** EPrints community wiki: http://wiki.eprints.org/
*** EPrints developers Forum: http://forum.eprints.org/

 



*** Options: http://mailman.ecs.soton.ac.uk/mailman/listinfo/eprints-tech
*** Archive: http://www.eprints.org/tech.php/
*** EPrints community wiki: http://wiki.eprints.org/
*** EPrints developers Forum: http://forum.eprints.org/